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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 10:23:44 GMT
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 10:23:44 GMT
All over Twitter I'm seeing 'THIS MAN TOOK US INTO AN ILLEGAL WAR AND CAUSED THE DEATH OF THOUSANDS!!!'
But that doesn't mean he isn't making some sense some of the time. Or even most of the time.
Where do you stand on our much-disliked ex-PM? or would you just like to stand on him?
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Deleted
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 10:43:21 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2020 10:43:21 GMT
Putting it in capitals and exclamation marks suggests you think this is hysterical hyperbole but iI tsn't. He did take us into an illegal war and many lives were lost. This has damaged irrevocably his reputation and credibility and has robbed him of the elder statesman stature he so craves.
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:00:01 GMT
via mobile
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 11:00:01 GMT
I know.
but
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:06:19 GMT
Post by Reactionary Rage on Apr 22, 2020 11:06:19 GMT
I think he was a brilliant politician. Which to some is like saying "he was a very capable serial killer!" but there you go. Considering what we have currently and the paucity of talent across the spectrum I do find myself missing (a bit) the likes of Blair or Brown just because at least they were politicians, statesmen rather than just populist vultures.
Iraq aside (yeah, I know) New Labour did some good things and I think Blair fundamentally understood the British public (and still does) more than most people within that party seem to do.
Like all politicians they are more likeable out of office and when I listen to him these days I think he talks a lot of sense - although I disagreed with him on Brexit - and he's a voice worth listening to. For example, his speech on Labour's problems was on the mark but because he's worse than Hitler people ignore him
I voted mixed feelings
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Deleted
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:10:30 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2020 11:10:30 GMT
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:17:35 GMT
via mobile
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 11:17:35 GMT
Jesus, G! do I have to spell it out?
He did bad things. Yes. True. But should we ban him from the airwaves?
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:19:27 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2020 11:19:27 GMT
New Labour did some good things, but were too in thrall to powerful business and made some very ill-judged moves in education and health. I mean I've been all over this before so I don't want to go over old ground. Overall it was a missed opportunity. Blair was an incredibly good communicator, but lacked a deep rooted vision. He is much closer to Johnson than he'd like to believe.
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:20:22 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2020 11:20:22 GMT
Jesus, G! do I have to spell it out? He did bad things. Yes. True. But should we ban him from the airwaves? Who is suggesting that?
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:23:49 GMT
via mobile
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 11:23:49 GMT
Ted Rogers
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:46:27 GMT
Post by Reactionary Rage on Apr 22, 2020 11:46:27 GMT
All over Twitter I'm seeing 'THIS MAN TOOK US INTO AN ILLEGAL WAR AND CAUSED THE DEATH OF THOUSANDS!!!' But that doesn't mean he isn't making some sense some of the time. Or even most of the time. Where do you stand on our much-disliked ex-PM? or would you just like to stand on him? What's that Orwell line about the Telegraph? Just because it's in the Telegraph doesn't mean it's not true. Or summat.
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 11:57:46 GMT
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 11:57:46 GMT
Like all politicians they are more likeable out of office and when I listen to him these days I think he talks a lot of sense - although I disagreed with him on Brexit - and he's a voice worth listening to. For example, his speech on Labour's problems was on the mark but because he's worse than Hitler people ignore him I agree with most of that, altho' I don't find him at all likeable. Oddly I'd say former Tory frontbenchers such as Clarke, Heseltine and Major have more charm. Altho' I wouldn't say he's a voice we need to hear, we ARE, I think, keen to get some kind of guidance or wisdom from senior figures in these difficult times - and I think more often than not he provides that. He certainly holds my interest more than any of the clowns we have in power right now (of course it's easier for him as an outsider). G - I understand your reservations but if you HAD to choose a current MP or political figure who's worth listening to, who would you go for?
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 12:10:27 GMT
Post by tory on Apr 22, 2020 12:10:27 GMT
He is the arch-rationalist. He was a superb communicator who instinctively understood the mood of the times, but I'd also say that he is symbolic of the utter vacuum of meaningfulness that is the British political scene. For an educated man he never came off as particularly intelligent, but instead was a powerful rhetorician with the cunning ability to get you to agree with what he's saying.
"He's right you know".
I'm reading Volker Ullrich's brilliant biography of Hitler and they said the same thing back then. Not that I'm comparing him explicitly!
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 12:20:04 GMT
Post by Reactionary Rage on Apr 22, 2020 12:20:04 GMT
Like all politicians they are more likeable out of office and when I listen to him these days I think he talks a lot of sense - although I disagreed with him on Brexit - and he's a voice worth listening to. For example, his speech on Labour's problems was on the mark but because he's worse than Hitler people ignore him I agree with most of that, altho' I don't find him at all likeable. Oddly I'd say former Tory frontbenchers such as Clarke, Heseltine and Major have more charm. Altho' I wouldn't say he's a voice we need to hear, we ARE, I think, keen to get some kind of guidance or wisdom from senior figures in these difficult times - and I think more often than not he provides that. He certainly holds my interest more than any of the clowns we have in power right now (of course it's easier for him as an outsider). G - I understand your reservations but if you HAD to choose a current MP or political figure who's worth listening to, who would you go for? Yeah, I don't find him likeable (he's still got that dead eyed stare) but as a general rule....Portillo, Ed Balls, Clarke etc. The job makes them inhuman...all appearances and bullshit. Once free from Westminster you see the human being dontcha. Maybe being an ex PM he feels he still has that prime ministerial burnish to maintain. At least with him or Brown there is an intellect there, some stature, some insight. Like I said, I do find myself feeling a bit nostalgic (not the right choice of word here but you understand where I'm coming from) when I look back sometimes. To think Labour went from them to the likes of Rayner, Burgon, Corbyn et al. Something has gone very wrong in politics. I think I'd just like some adults back in the room please. The same applies to The Other Lot.
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 12:20:15 GMT
Post by Crunchy Col on Apr 22, 2020 12:20:15 GMT
For an educated man he never came off as particularly intelligent He's probably the most intelligent PM this country had in the 20th C.
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Blair
Apr 22, 2020 12:21:32 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 22, 2020 12:21:32 GMT
He is the arch-rationalist. He was a superb communicator who instinctively understood the mood of the times, but I'd also say that he is symbolic of the utter vacuum of meaningfulness that is the British political scene. For an educated man he never came off as particularly intelligent, but instead was a powerful rhetorician with the cunning ability to get you to agree with what he's saying. I'd agree and that's why I said he's much closer to Johnson than he'd like to think.
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