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racism
Jul 7, 2020 16:24:42 GMT
Post by tory on Jul 7, 2020 16:24:42 GMT
So, at the important part of society in the US (perhaps not the very, very top ie the super rich) - the political executive - you would say that as a whole there is a positive movement towards representation that matches the demographic of the country?
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Post by daveythefatboy on Jul 7, 2020 16:49:37 GMT
So, at the important part of society in the US (perhaps not the very, very top ie the super rich) - the political executive - you would say that as a whole there is a positive movement towards representation that matches the demographic of the country? I wouldn’t frame it quite that way. There’s been one non-white President in our history, as compared to 44 White men. The current President only has one Black person in their Cabinet. The Senate is 91% White. There are currently two Black Senators (2%). There have only been 10 Black Senators in US history. The House is 78% White (Black representation finally reached 12% - which is close to on par for their 13% of the population, but Hispanic representation lags greatly). The Judiciary is 80% White. 9.9% of sitting Judges are African American (compared to 13% of the population). Only one Black judge sits on the Supreme Court. There have been two in the nation’s history.
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Sneelock
god
you're gonna break another heart
Posts: 8,546
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Post by Sneelock on Jul 7, 2020 17:37:48 GMT
and furthermore, the President of the Untied States stood in front of perhaps our most famous monument and pledged to destroy not only movements for Social Justice but the very concept of Social Justice itself.
in doubling down on "our" heritage he is, in fact, defending the confederacy. he does it frequently and he seems to be doing more of it. racism is an active component in this President's personal style and re-election strategy.
he has taken Nixon's "law and order" rhetoric to a ghastly "Us versus Them" level that, in my personal opinion, makes calling his intentions "fascistic" completely fair and even handed.
the U.S. has moved to a very dark place and racism is a powerful component of that. it's as plain as the nose on my face.
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rayge
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Post by rayge on Jul 8, 2020 12:33:21 GMT
A bit tangential, but my friend Tony Thorne, a linguist and lexicographer, has just posted this blog about language and race – containing several links to a warren of other articles on the subjects. I thought it was fascinating, but each to their own
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Sneelock
god
you're gonna break another heart
Posts: 8,546
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racism
Jul 8, 2020 22:57:05 GMT
Post by Sneelock on Jul 8, 2020 22:57:05 GMT
you know, President TRUMP's fourth of July Nuremberg Rally at Mount Rushmore isn't the first time I've heard about "the five kings" but it's the first time I held both thoughts in my head at the same time. My Country's most iconic symbol was a deliberate defacement of an iconic symbol of the people my forefathers slaughtered.
I know I'm a little slow on the draw but putting those two thoughts together shouldn't have taken me so long. in my defense, I could have used a little help. it shouldn't have taken a racist power mad lunatic to point this out to me. I'll bet my smart neices and nephews have an easier time getting these things straight in their heads.
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 7:38:31 GMT
Post by cousinlou on Jul 9, 2020 7:38:31 GMT
A bit tangential, but my friend Tony Thorne, a linguist and lexicographer, has just posted this blog about language and race – containing several links to a warren of other articles on the subjects. I thought it was fascinating, but each to their own
Haven't read all of it yet but certainly will. By clicking on one of the links ( Huffington post) I learned that a word I have never thought anything special of,('articulate') can be construed as racist.
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Sneelock
god
you're gonna break another heart
Posts: 8,546
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 10:50:28 GMT
Post by Sneelock on Jul 9, 2020 10:50:28 GMT
Joe Biden can tell you all about that.
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 13:53:25 GMT
Post by sloopjohnc on Jul 9, 2020 13:53:25 GMT
The UK is one of the most tolerant places in the world. In a survey, 60% of people in this country are happy to live next to people of different heritage. Even amongst the older generation, this only drops to 55%. Compare that to 27% in Italy and 45% in France. Doesn't Brexit and the threat of immigration that partly fueled the movement kinda destroy your claim of the UK's tolerance? I've been to the UK four times. I was shocked at the amount of racist graffiti on walls in Surrey and London where I was staying in 1979. Surrey, I could kinda understand, but I thought London was a pretty international place. It may have gotten better, and I'm no researcher, but I don't know if the English have very much experience. I've mentioned this before, but on my last trip I was also shocked by the amount of Caucasian faces I saw in No. England, where I stayed. The non-Caucasian faces I did see were at ethnic restaurants or other businesses, which made sense, but the lack of multiple ethnicities just walking around astounded me. I hadn't been back in 15 years and the area I live in is very diverse so it was more overwhelming. My point is it's easy to say you're tolerant when you're not faced with having to do anything about it or live it. I also don't think people answer surveys like this very honestly, even blind surveys, for fear of expulsion and other reasons, if you are a minority. My experiences are purely anecdotal, so my statements are pretty limited too.
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Post by Half Machine Lipschitz on Jul 9, 2020 14:35:55 GMT
"Let's all do the Tolerance Dance!"
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 15:07:04 GMT
Post by oh oooh on Jul 9, 2020 15:07:04 GMT
I've mentioned this before, but on my last trip I was also shocked by the amount of Caucasian faces I saw in No. England, where I stayed. The non-Caucasian faces I did see were at ethnic restaurants or other businesses, which made sense, but the lack of multiple ethnicities just walking around astounded me. It's still true in many places in the UK, especially outside the cities. We're nothing like the 'melting pot' USA, but I don't know that I'd draw too many conclusions based on that key difference. But casual, vocalised racism exists all over the country.
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 15:27:53 GMT
Post by Johnny Fartpants on Jul 9, 2020 15:27:53 GMT
Doesn't Brexit and the threat of immigration that partly fueled the movement kinda destroy your claim of the UK's tolerance? I've been to the UK four times. I was shocked at the amount of racist graffiti on walls in Surrey and London where I was staying in 1979. Surrey, I could kinda understand, but I thought London was a pretty international place. It may have gotten better, and I'm no researcher, but I don't know if the English have very much experience. I've mentioned this before, but on my last trip I was also shocked by the amount of Caucasian faces I saw in No. England, where I stayed. The non-Caucasian faces I did see were at ethnic restaurants or other businesses, which made sense, but the lack of multiple ethnicities just walking around astounded me. I hadn't been back in 15 years and the area I live in is very diverse so it was more overwhelming. My point is it's easy to say you're tolerant when you're not faced with having to do anything about it or live it. I also don't think people answer surveys like this very honestly, even blind surveys, for fear of expulsion and other reasons, if you are a minority. My experiences are purely anecdotal, so my statements are pretty limited too.
To be fair John, you are talking about the late 1970s, over 40 years ago. Britain and it's attitude to racism was very different then. There were still openly racist TV programmes airing at that point, or not long before then ... Love Thy Neighbour, The Black and White Minstrel Show. There were still openly racist comedians on prime time TV, people like Jim Davidson, Bernard Manning and others. So yes, things have very much changed since then and for the better. And suggesting that the only places you'd see ethnic faces is at ethnic restaurants and businesses shows how out of touch your views are.
London is a hugely multi-cultural city, as are Birmingham, Leeds, Bradford, Manchester and others, but maybe to a lesser degree than London. The city of Leicester became the first city in the UK where official figures show the population to be more than 50% "ethnic" for want of a better word. In other words less than half the population of the city is "Caucasian native British" ... again for want of a better description, but you know what I mean.
I am not going to suggest that Britain doesn't still have a problem with racism, because it does. You only have to look at the racist dickhead who is prime minister at the moment to see that. And yes, the Brexit vote and it's aftermath did show a rise in race related attacks and incidents. But whilst immigration was of course a major influence on the Brexit vote, it wasn't the only factor ... i.e. not everyone who voted Brexit is a racist and likewise there will have been racists that voted Remain for different reasons. But I do believe that Britain has become a much more tolerant society, particularly over the last 20 years or so. Whilst there is still the very small minority of idiots who make racist chants at football matches, compared to the 1970s and 80s, this has almost disappeared from football in the UK now. And on the few occasions it does happen, they are normally caught on camera and are taken to court for it. And in many cases you can see other people in the crowd telling the minority to stop the chanting. It's not perfect, but it is a hell of a lot better.
So I would stand by the comment that Britain, in broad terms, is now a tolerant society and certainly more so than most of our larger European neighbours like France, Italy and Germany. Whilst the Conservatives are on the right, the more extreme right wing parties such as UKIP and the BNP have been more or less eradicated. UKIP briefly had one MP, but they didn't last long. They both became more or less an irrelevance at the last election. Whereas in countries like France, Germany and more surprisingly, Poland, the rise of the far right in politics is still very much growing.
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 15:39:05 GMT
Post by sloopjohnc on Jul 9, 2020 15:39:05 GMT
I appreciate the input, thanks.
Last weekend, I was up at my ex brother-in-law's place where we did some stuff together and my son got to visit with his cousins. My brother-in-law is Black and we were talking about the BLM movement, etc. We are good friends and I'm the godfather of his youngest.
He was telling me that an old neighbor of his, a White woman that lived next to them 10 years ago in San Jose, called him out of the blue to give her support. My brother-in-law was polite, but was basically, "Whatever."
After he finished, I said to him, "You know why she called you, right?" He didn't say anything.
I said, "Because you are the only Black person she knows."
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racism
Jul 9, 2020 15:42:53 GMT
Post by sloopjohnc on Jul 9, 2020 15:42:53 GMT
Doesn't Brexit and the threat of immigration that partly fueled the movement kinda destroy your claim of the UK's tolerance? I've been to the UK four times. I was shocked at the amount of racist graffiti on walls in Surrey and London where I was staying in 1979. Surrey, I could kinda understand, but I thought London was a pretty international place. It may have gotten better, and I'm no researcher, but I don't know if the English have very much experience. I've mentioned this before, but on my last trip I was also shocked by the amount of Caucasian faces I saw in No. England, where I stayed. The non-Caucasian faces I did see were at ethnic restaurants or other businesses, which made sense, but the lack of multiple ethnicities just walking around astounded me. I hadn't been back in 15 years and the area I live in is very diverse so it was more overwhelming. My point is it's easy to say you're tolerant when you're not faced with having to do anything about it or live it. I also don't think people answer surveys like this very honestly, even blind surveys, for fear of expulsion and other reasons, if you are a minority. My experiences are purely anecdotal, so my statements are pretty limited too.
So I would stand by the comment that Britain, in broad terms, is now a tolerant society and certainly more so than most of our larger European neighbours like France, Italy and Germany. Whilst the Conservatives are on the right, the more extreme right wing parties such as UKIP and the BNP have been more or less eradicated. UKIP briefly had one MP, but they didn't last long. They both became more or less an irrelevance at the last election. Whereas in countries like France, Germany and more surprisingly, Poland, the rise of the far right in politics is still very much growing.
I am interested in this. I don't know, but I'd think the UK had the highest percentage of white folks, except for maybe the Scandanavian countries. Do you think the other countries are having more problems because of the influx of immigrants from Africa and the Middle East? I'm doing lots of assuming here, I understand that.
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~ / % ? *
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Post by ~ / % ? * on Jul 9, 2020 18:56:49 GMT
WSJ:American Indian Lands Include Eastern Oklahoma, Supreme Court Rules
WASHINGTON—The Supreme Court ruled Thursday that nearly half of Oklahoma falls within the Muscogee (Creek) Indian Reservation, over the objections of the federal and state governments, enforcing 19th century treaties the U.S. made with the tribe.
Justice Neil Gorsuch wrote for the 5-4 court, joined by liberal Justices Ruth Bader Ginsburg, Stephen Breyer, Sonia Sotomayor and Elena Kagan. Four other conservatives dissented.
At issue was whether Oklahoma’s admission to the Union in 1907 dissolved the Muscogee (Creek) reservation that covered the state’s eastern half, including its second most populous city, Tulsa. Congress never formally voted to terminate Creek sovereignty, but the federal and state governments contended that the effect of Oklahoma statehood following several actions to diminish Indian self-rule amounted to the same thing.
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Deleted
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racism
Jul 11, 2020 1:02:39 GMT
Post by Deleted on Jul 11, 2020 1:02:39 GMT
A bit tangential, but my friend Tony Thorne, a linguist and lexicographer, has just posted this blog about language and race – containing several links to a warren of other articles on the subjects. I thought it was fascinating, but each to their own
Haven't read all of it yet but certainly will. By clicking on one of the links ( Huffington post) I learned that a word I have never thought anything special of,('articulate') can be construed as racist. I wasn't convinced by that example at all.
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