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Post by tory on May 26, 2020 8:53:48 GMT
You're always told that "bullies have low self-esteem" etc. But it appears that this is not the case and that bullies, at school anyway, enjoy social esteem and popularity. In your experience, does that correlate?
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on May 26, 2020 10:56:13 GMT
The school bullies I knew tended to be popular because they were funny, not because they were bullies.
The second paragraph made me laugh: 'bullies can also gain access to greater economic resources'. That's the bullshit way of saying 'they steal kids' lunch money', right?
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Post by Charlie O. on May 26, 2020 12:45:35 GMT
I think they were perceived as more popular, yes.
I always assumed that they were more feared than actually liked, but I'm no longer so sure of that; certainly Donald Trump is a bully, and his worshipers like him rather than fear him.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2020 13:49:15 GMT
You're always told that "bullies have low self-esteem" etc. But it appears that this is not the case and that bullies, at school anyway, enjoy social esteem and popularity. In your experience, does that correlate? You can have low self esteem and still be popular, so I wouldn't call that a contradiction. This is more an alpha male thing I think, the bigger and more powerful males dominating the rest of the pack
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Post by ~ / % ? * on May 26, 2020 14:59:19 GMT
This appears to be a literature review (not a study in itself) of existing studies, which also means one could do a literature coming from the other point of view (particularly since many of these studies quoted are over ten years old, which can be a weakness).
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on May 26, 2020 16:11:04 GMT
Yeah, I think Gav's right. It just looks like an extract from a literature review - it isn't some sort of conclusive piece from a published and respected journal, for instance.
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Post by Deleted on May 26, 2020 17:23:32 GMT
As said, low self esteem and popularity aren't mutually exclusive. Many feel the need to build the feeling of popularity precisely because they're insecure, especially when they're young.
Part of my job is assessing cases of domestic abuse and I wouldn't say there's a typical bully profile as a catch all. There are general groups that abusers and bullies (to use the terms interchangeably) fall into: learned behaviour from family members or social peers, the cultural role of women in societies, personality disorders, the exploitation of the mentally vulnerable or learning disabled, a psychological instinct to control other people and relationships for financial reward or sexual gratitude, etc.
I wouldn't say that any of the 'abusers' in these case studies came across as particularly popular as adults. They may well have been as kids, the school ground is a different dynamic which forces children together in groups before they're acclimatised to societies, and the notion of popularity there is often linked with pack security rather than simply enjoying someone's company. Many school bullies learn empathy and grow out of it and others don't.
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Post by Sneelock on May 27, 2020 15:27:26 GMT
fear is a type of popularity, n'est ce pas?
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Post by ~ / % ? * on May 27, 2020 16:36:42 GMT
You're always told that "bullies have low self-esteem" etc. But it appears that this is not the case and that bullies, at school anyway, enjoy social esteem and popularity.
In your experience, does that correlate?
I think it can be a mix, but i would not correlate high popularity with high self esteem. Even the average teen film nowadays postulates on the hollowness of being popular, and the possible neediness that kids may be trying to fulfill through popularity's pursuit.
Some bullies I remember were popular, others lost it over time through the passage through different grades. Other bullies, possibly the most dangerous ones were not popular but somewhat shunned but feared. The popular bullies were somewhat kept in check if they cared about or noticed their popularity, being seen as too vicious could cost them.
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Post by Sneelock on May 27, 2020 18:07:05 GMT
I was a weird kid and changed schools a lot so I'd like to think I have a Master's Degree in Bullies. I think there were largely three types: the physical asshole "beat you up" bullies. the "not very clever but wants to be a smart ass" bully and the ones that combine the two.
I had the extreme pleasure of actually befriending a kid who bullied me when we were maybe 14 in our early twenties. he never really responded to why he bullied me but he became a very good friend and a very sweet guy. I always just figured his priorities changed. lucky for me because I was glad to know him instead of spending the rest of my life hating my memory of him as a 14 year old.
my favorite bully story was being at a party when I was maybe 17 years old. "Stickney!! Stickney!!! Remember me?" yeah, I did. I remembered he used to physically beat the snot out of me after 5th period almost every day for nearly an entire semester. "hey, Billy. uh, how you doing?" Billy then proceeded to apologize to me. He pumped my arm - he was really glad to see me. He told me that he remembered I was a funny fucker and that I got more laughs in 5th period than he did so he decided he had to teach me a lesson. he told me he didn't do that shit anymore and seemed genuinely interested in how things were going for me. I never saw Billy X again but it had a funny effect on me. I mean, he was so fuckin' mean to me but obviously he had really good memories of me.
life is some funny shit.
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