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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2021 10:10:48 GMT
It's a shame that when people talk about the Smiths these days it often ends up with chat about Morrissey's politics. Was Weller a better lyricist? People would point to Eton Rifles and That's Entertainment as proof wouldn't they? He has that interest in social commentary that appeals but I find him quite clunky and ripe at times, like he's trying too hard. Something like English Rose makes me wince a little. Morrissey is more personal, funnier, wittier and more touching too. With Weller you can trace him back to Davies and Townshend, there is an obvious lineage there but with Morrissey he really came out of thin air, a singular creation. He is really unlike anybody else and you can see that in the hero worship he has inspired around the world. People really connect to him emotionally in a way that they don't with Weller. Genuine question...have the Jam done something as moving, romantic and elegiac as There Is A Light That Never Goes Out? Does Weller ever touch you emotionally in the same way that Morrissey does here? Yes is the short answer. Morrissey is the more original lyricist, I'll happily concede that. But you're stepping into Morrissey's world and having to share his obsessions. Weller had a more 'everyman' quality and could write songs that spoke to everyone's experience. As for 'The Light..' I find it over- ripe with that queasy string arrangement.Its melodrama is too knowing, piled on too thickly. Give me 'Lisa Radley' anytime.
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Aug 4, 2021 10:38:49 GMT
As for 'The Light..' I find it over- ripe with that queasy string arrangement.Its melodrama is too knowing, piled on too thickly. Give me 'Lisa Radley' anytime. I was ready to post 'Liza Radley' here with a mocking comment, thinking 'I'll show that G lad up!' but I listened and I have to say it's sweet.
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fange
god
Listening to long jazz tracks
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Post by fange on Aug 4, 2021 10:57:37 GMT
'LR' is lovely indeed, a little gem in the tradition of The Kinks or The Who. For me though 'There Is A Light...' goes that next step, a singular, epic statement that builds on the past with a new sensibility. One for the ages.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2021 11:32:19 GMT
'LR' is lovely indeed, a little gem in the tradition of The Kinks or The Who. For me though 'There Is A Light...' goes that next step, a singular, epic statement that builds on the past with a new sensibility. One for the ages. I believe in 'Liza Radley' in a way I don't 'There is a Light'. The sentiment in the former seems more heartfelt, the latter more for show.
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Aug 4, 2021 13:50:15 GMT
It's a shame that when people talk about the Smiths these days it often ends up with chat about Morrissey's politics. Was Weller a better lyricist? People would point to Eton Rifles and That's Entertainment as proof wouldn't they? He has that interest in social commentary that appeals but I find him quite clunky and ripe at times, like he's trying too hard. Something like English Rose makes me wince a little. Morrissey is more personal, funnier, wittier and more touching too. With Weller you can trace him back to Davies and Townshend, there is an obvious lineage there but with Morrissey he really came out of thin air, a singular creation. He is really unlike anybody else and you can see that in the hero worship he has inspired around the world. People really connect to him emotionally in a way that they don't with Weller. Genuine question...have the Jam done something as moving, romantic and elegiac as There Is A Light That Never Goes Out? Does Weller ever touch you emotionally in the same way that Morrissey does here? Yes is the short answer. Morrissey is the more original lyricist, I'll happily concede that. But you're stepping into Morrissey's world and having to share his obsessions. Weller had a more 'everyman' quality and could write songs that spoke to everyone's experience. As for 'The Light..' I find it over- ripe with that queasy string arrangement.Its melodrama is too knowing, piled on too thickly. Give me 'Lisa Radley' anytime. One mans "over ripe" is another's mans evocative Northern romanticism that really moves I guess. What does "knowing" mean here? Too obvious? Too deliberate? Too self aware hence diluted? I don't think Marr overplays it here, it's not ironic, it's sincere. He knows when to push it and he knows when to let it bubble away in the background foretelling the grander moments to come. Listen to that section that soundtracks the "darkened underpass..." verse....there is a twilight, twinkling beauty here verging on a kind of northern magic realism where even some brief moment in an urban underpass feels like something out of a dream. When you are young and you are living these moments they really do feel like life and death and Marr understands this as does Mozza. The unbearable pain of a missed opportunity with a lass you're crazy about, the longing that will never be fulfilled, the drunken walk home alone (again); all of these things combine and take on the quality of a movie or a poem in your head. Marrs uncanny arrangement has a suitably cinematic quality that understands the potency of all this and elevates it into some widescreen drama befitting its significance at that moment in time. And it's not as if Mozza is talking about some elliptical, highly personal experience here. It's universal stuff just delivered in an idiosyncratic way, one that finds humour and permanence in the tragic and the ephemeral. And the lyric really taps into something quite profound. That thing people do when they elevate their own experiences by creating their own life story, their own internal movie where small moments take on a kind of sacred significance that only exist in your head. At that brief moment, in the crummy underpass there is something quite beautiful and profound going on. A romantic pledge that the girl will never know about. The "light" therefore is eternal, at least for a little while. But then...maybe he will never move on. Maybe he will always carry that flame you know. Liza Radley is nice enough but it's bloodless and arid in comparison. Not even close G lad!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2021 13:58:27 GMT
Obvious yes and overdone. It stood out on the album initially, but its appeal for me soon waned. I have a hard time imagining any adult enjoying it, much less being moved by it. It's all very adolescent.
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Post by cousinlou on Aug 4, 2021 17:40:47 GMT
Yes is the short answer. Morrissey is the more original lyricist, I'll happily concede that. But you're stepping into Morrissey's world and having to share his obsessions. Weller had a more 'everyman' quality and could write songs that spoke to everyone's experience. As for 'The Light..' I find it over- ripe with that queasy string arrangement.Its melodrama is too knowing, piled on too thickly. Give me 'Lisa Radley' anytime. One mans "over ripe" is another's mans evocative Northern romanticism that really moves I guess. What does "knowing" mean here? Too obvious? Too deliberate? Too self aware hence diluted? I don't think Marr overplays it here, it's not ironic, it's sincere. He knows when to push it and he knows when to let it bubble away in the background foretelling the grander moments to come. Listen to that section that soundtracks the "darkened underpass..." verse....there is a twilight, twinkling beauty here verging on a kind of northern magic realism where even some brief moment in an urban underpass feels like something out of a dream. When you are young and you are living these moments they really do feel like life and death and Marr understands this as does Mozza. The unbearable pain of a missed opportunity with a lass you're crazy about, the longing that will never be fulfilled, the drunken walk home alone (again); all of these things combine and take on the quality of a movie or a poem in your head. Marrs uncanny arrangement has a suitably cinematic quality that understands the potency of all this and elevates it into some widescreen drama befitting its significance at that moment in time. And it's not as if Mozza is talking about some elliptical, highly personal experience here. It's universal stuff just delivered in an idiosyncratic way, one that finds humour and permanence in the tragic and the ephemeral. And the lyric really taps into something quite profound. That thing people do when they elevate their own experiences by creating their own life story, their own internal movie where small moments take on a kind of sacred significance that only exist in your head. At that brief moment, in the crummy underpass there is something quite beautiful and profound going on. A romantic pledge that the girl will never know about. The "light" therefore is eternal, at least for a little while. But then...maybe he will never move on. Maybe he will always carry that flame you know. Liza Radley is nice enough but it's bloodless and arid in comparison. Not even close G lad! Brilliant writing and spot on!! Great work GB!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 4, 2021 19:39:37 GMT
It's a shame that when people talk about the Smiths these days it often ends up with chat about Morrissey's politics. Was Weller a better lyricist? People would point to Eton Rifles and That's Entertainment as proof wouldn't they? He has that interest in social commentary that appeals but I find him quite clunky and ripe at times, like he's trying too hard. Something like English Rose makes me wince a little. Morrissey is more personal, funnier, wittier and more touching too. With Weller you can trace him back to Davies and Townshend, there is an obvious lineage there but with Morrissey he really came out of thin air, a singular creation. He is really unlike anybody else and you can see that in the hero worship he has inspired around the world. People really connect to him emotionally in a way that they don't with Weller. Genuine question...have the Jam done something as moving, romantic and elegiac as There Is A Light That Never Goes Out? Does Weller ever touch you emotionally in the same way that Morrissey does here? I was just trying to create a bit of controversy if I'm being honest, not enough of it if you ask me.... My mum passed away a couple of years back and I remember "There Is A Light That Never Goes Out" was on heavy rotation. Not sure why cause it's not like we could have crashed into a double decker bus anymore....but I'd always struggled with Morrisey as a lyricist in terms of emotional connection etc until that all happened so maybe it's a case of life experience and being able to relate that to peoples lyrics. I connect to Wellers lyrics as well. But he aways seems more concerned with the world around him rather than the world inside him.....not a bad thing, guess it just depends on how introspective you are feeling.....
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Aug 12, 2021 12:25:19 GMT
There are a few of these on youtube. Lovely stuff.
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