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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 8:12:00 GMT
Some shocking claims being made here.
Popular music from Ireland, Scotland and Wales tends to be pretty naff. There are only a few exceptions.
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Post by Stacy Heydon on Dec 8, 2022 9:37:03 GMT
Some shocking claims being made here. Popular music from Ireland, Scotland and Wales tends to be pretty naff. There are only a few exceptions. How can you say that? Just look at your original list?
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Dec 8, 2022 9:49:38 GMT
John has a point. I do think Scottish pop is a cut above the other Celtic nations mind. At least from punk and Postcard onwards. We had a decent 80s.
However, a statement like this....
I think more great records came out of Scotland than any other place, other than Memphis in the 60s or somewhere like that.
Is a bit like saying more good looking women come out of Dundee than Rome.
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 9:54:35 GMT
Some shocking claims being made here. Popular music from Ireland, Scotland and Wales tends to be pretty naff. There are only a few exceptions. How can you say that? Just look at your original list? The exceptions!
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Post by Stacy Heydon on Dec 8, 2022 10:00:50 GMT
John has a point. I do think Scottish pop is a cut above the other Celtic nations mind. At least from punk and Postcard onwards. We had a decent 80s. However, a statement like this.... I think more great records came out of Scotland than any other place, other than Memphis in the 60s or somewhere like that.Is a bit like saying more good looking women come out of Dundee than Rome. Is it though? Orange Juice, Simple Minds, The Associates, The Fire Engines, The Cocteau Twins, The Blue Nile, Jesus and Mary Chain, Aztec Camera, Josef K, Altered Images, The Scars, The Waterboys etc. It's a pretty impressive list. Post 60s (because I take the point that American cities such as New Orleans, Memphis, Chicago and Detroit produced more in that time), I'd say it compares favourably to anywhere.
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Post by Stacy Heydon on Dec 8, 2022 10:01:43 GMT
How can you say that? Just look at your original list? The exceptions! Five is rather a lot John to sustain your argument!
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 10:06:25 GMT
Eh?
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Post by Stacy Heydon on Dec 8, 2022 10:07:28 GMT
When people say exceptions, they normally mean one or two!
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 10:16:02 GMT
No they don't! You could make a list of 50 Scottish bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 25000 examples through the decades. You've put together a good list (although The Fire Engines are dare I say a very 'G band' with little broad appeal ,JAMC are dreadful wank and The Scars I've never heard of) but the general tendency to stand on a mountain top and sing poorly but dramatically in a semi-patriotic way is a feature of most other bands from the region. How about we compare English bands from the same era? (roughly the 1980s)
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Post by Stacy Heydon on Dec 8, 2022 10:20:46 GMT
No they don't! You could make a list of 50 Scottish bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 25000 examples through the decades. You've put together a good list (although The Fire Engines are dare I say a very 'G band' with little broad appeal ,JAMC are dreadful wank and The Scars I've never heard of) but the general tendency to stand on a mountain top and sing poorly but dramatically in a semi-patriotic way is a feature of most other bands from the region. How about we compare English bands from the same era? (roughly the 1980s) England has about ten times the size of population and you'd probably come up with a similar number, so that proves my point. And you really should know The Scars.
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Dec 8, 2022 10:36:36 GMT
John has a point. I do think Scottish pop is a cut above the other Celtic nations mind. At least from punk and Postcard onwards. We had a decent 80s. However, a statement like this.... I think more great records came out of Scotland than any other place, other than Memphis in the 60s or somewhere like that.Is a bit like saying more good looking women come out of Dundee than Rome. Is it though? Orange Juice, Simple Minds, The Associates, The Fire Engines, The Cocteau Twins, The Blue Nile, Jesus and Mary Chain, Aztec Camera, Josef K, Altered Images, The Scars, The Waterboys etc. It's a pretty impressive list. Post 60s (because I take the point that American cities such as New Orleans, Memphis, Chicago and Detroit produced more in that time), I'd say it compares favourably to anywhere. I wouldn’t go that far – I mean you could pick Manchester alone and it would probably beat it or at least give it a run for its money - but it’s certainly much better than some would suggest. Too often people reduce Scottish music from that period to the chest thumping, widescreen Celtic romanticism of Big Country (it’s a Celtic thing, like U2) or the bland, wine bar, yuppie pop music of Deacon Blue or Wet Wet Wet but it’s actually a lot more colourful and weird than that with some genuine high points. Bands like the Cocteau’s and Associates were as singular as anything the rest of the UK produced and nothing like the clichéd stereotypes one might associate with the Scots. Similarly Simple Minds who, again, have been reduced by detractors to some generic, Celtic, stadium rock thing were of course a completely different prospect early on in their career. The Blue Nile (I still haven’t written that post) were, imo, the greatest of them all and created a particularly Scottish brand of what some today call “sophisticated pop” music that ached with all the pain, heartbreak and occasional transcendence of adulthood that was exceptionally evocative of time and place (Glasgow at night). Of course, there are also cracking one off singles too, like Feel Like Heaven etc.
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Dec 8, 2022 10:39:28 GMT
but the general tendency to stand on a mountain top and sing poorly but dramatically in a semi-patriotic way is a feature of most other bands from the region. Who are these bands exactly?
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rayge
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Posts: 8,786
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Post by rayge on Dec 8, 2022 10:42:10 GMT
No they don't! You could make a list of 50 Scottish bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 25000 examples through the decades. There ten times as many people in England as Scotland. You could make a list of 500 English bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 250,000 examples through the decades.
I know you're a language teacher, John, but you're very dodgy when it comes to numeracy: not quite as bad as maths teacher C is at using language, admittedly
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 10:42:18 GMT
Just google 'Scottish bands'
Big Country, Runrig, all that lot
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Dec 8, 2022 10:43:20 GMT
No they don't! You could make a list of 50 Scottish bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 25000 examples through the decades. You could make a list of 500 English bands and they'd still be the exceptions because there have been 250,000 examples through the decades.
I know you're a language teacher, John, but that is numerate stupidism.
Eh? 'exceptions' is synonymous with 'small minority', right?
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