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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 23, 2020 2:48:37 GMT
Right. Does the concept of “art rock” even exist without The Beatles and Dylan?
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Post by Charlie O. on Sept 23, 2020 2:48:51 GMT
Fun fact: Brian Epstein loved the banana album. He told Lou he wanted to get something going for the VU in England, but died shortly thereafter.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 7:17:17 GMT
I would say the Velvets did more and travelled further on their first album. Sunday Morning to European son ( all killer- no filler) But they arrrived fully formed which is different.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 7:21:46 GMT
I will say that if you picked the best of The Velvets and pitched it against the best of The Beatles it becomes a closer call. But part of the wonder of The Beatles is they did so much and travelled so far. I think the Velvets also 'travelled far'. It's almost impossible to argue against the idea that the Beatles are the greatest group of all time because on message boards like this it's an absolutely entrenched view. And it's probably a fair one too. All I've got is this: I don't really care for McCartney's songs very much (thank fuck San Juan isn't knocking around these days!). This wasn't always my view. I love Ram and a fair few of his Fabs' songs, and I'll admit he had a rare knack for melody. But these days, whenever those big doe eyes are too upfront, I step back. 'I've Just Seen A Face', 'Here There and Everywhere', 'I Will', 'Michelle' - they make me puke. I'd take 'Pale Blue Eyes' over any of them. But that's not enough of an argument for you lot, I know. No it isn't. No band is perfect, including The Velvets. There's a sonic warmth about The Beatles I don't get from The Velvets, The Beatles are just more musical altogether.
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Sept 23, 2020 7:53:47 GMT
That's even less of an argument than mine!
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 8:07:30 GMT
That's even less of an argument than mine! I'm not driven to make the argument in any depth -sorry. However Davey has already expressed much of it in his post at the bottom of page 3. Very often I'll get bits of Beatles songs in my head, not choruses as such, but just little instrumental hooks or the sound of harmonies. But it's very difficult to say why these things resonate so much, why a key change and a guitar pick in ' She Came in Through the Bathroom Window offer such a sense of well being and completeness, they just do. But that's just one aspect to them.
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Post by DarknessFish on Sept 23, 2020 8:39:56 GMT
Not like the Grand Canyon standing between She Loves You and I Am the Walrus. A grand canyon that they themselves created - it's hard to realistically imagine that anyone else would've if they hadn't. Really? Is that such a canyon? It doesn't seem that big a leap to me, and you'd have to accept that the sub-nursery-rhyme banality of She Loves You is a positive thing to make that any kind of creative argument.
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Sept 23, 2020 8:46:05 GMT
Ach, I wouldn't bother. Unless you want more regurgitated Rolling Stone 'wisdom'
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 23, 2020 8:52:49 GMT
Now hold on. We were specifically talking about the sound of the music. That’s what John asked me to address.
She Loves You doesn’t sound like a nursery rhyme. If you want to debate the lyric, we could. But I was talking about how different She Loves You sounds from I Am The Walrus. I don’t think you can point to two Velvet’s songs with as large a difference.
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Post by Mr. FOLLARD on Sept 23, 2020 8:55:33 GMT
'The Black Angel's Death Song' and 'Jesus'? 'White Light/White Heat' and 'Who Loves The Sun'?
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Post by Reactionary Rage on Sept 23, 2020 9:03:57 GMT
Not like the Grand Canyon standing between She Loves You and I Am the Walrus. A grand canyon that they themselves created - it's hard to realistically imagine that anyone else would've if they hadn't. I Am The walrus November 67.....Revolution...August 68 Just stylistically there the gap is enormous.
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 23, 2020 9:14:19 GMT
'The Black Angel's Death Song' and 'Jesus'? 'White Light/White Heat' and 'Who Loves The Sun'? Do those really sound entirely different to you? They’ve all got that tight little guitar combo in the middle, don’t they?
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 23, 2020 9:18:41 GMT
A grand canyon that they themselves created - it's hard to realistically imagine that anyone else would've if they hadn't. I Am The walrus November 67.....Revolution...August 68 Just stylistically there the gap there is enormous. How about Helter Skelter to Long, Long Long? Or Within You, Without You to When I’m 64?
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2020 9:19:38 GMT
Ach, I wouldn't bother. Unless you want more regurgitated Rolling Stone 'wisdom' That's unfair, as I suspect you know. You're looking for validation of your own feelings on this and you'll get it from some posters, but others will feel differently. And it won't be because they're reciting some "rote" opinion.
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 23, 2020 9:24:50 GMT
He misses Matt Wilson. Be kind.
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