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racism
Sept 28, 2020 16:58:41 GMT
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 28, 2020 16:58:41 GMT
The fact is that cultures (if we can call them that) all have differing characteristics. That is plainly true. Why do Sikhs and Jews, the latter despite centuries of oppression, perform in general, economically in hugely superior terms even to the native populations of countries they emigrate to? Asian cultures prize educational attainment as a way of getting ahead in the countries they emigrate to. This is also true of African cultures such as West Africans and those from Kenya. Muslim cultures in the UK, despite being socially conservative in the extreme, tend to vote Labour. Hindus vote Conservative in the main. It strikes me that the reasons behind this is the manifestation of strong family life, which despite oppression (for example, Chinese people are far more likely to be racially abused than black people in the UK) produces good results. I’m not sure where you are going with this. I’m pretty suspicious of any speculation that uses the success of one immigrant community as a cudgel against others viewed as less successful. What are we to take from that? That there is something wrong with the lower-attaining culture? In this case, that they don’t put enough premium on family? But certainly there are a few obvious factors that aren’t mentioned in your calculus. One is poverty. Immigrants from poorer countries tend to have more trouble getting ahead, as well as more problems around crime, addiction, etc. Then you’ve also left out indigenous communities and those who arrived unwillingly. Finally - there’s the question of systemic policies against some communities thriving that don’t impact all across the board. So again - I find this sort of analysis problematic... and I really don’t get what conclusions are meant to be drawn from it.
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racism
Sept 28, 2020 17:14:08 GMT
Post by tory on Sept 28, 2020 17:14:08 GMT
Again, I think we are at cross-purposes here.
You are talking about an explicitly American experience, with mention of indigenous communities and those who "arrived unwillingly". There is little or none of that particular context in either the UK or Europe as a whole.
I get that the issue of racism has variables in the US that aren't similar to Europe. As I've mentioned previously in this thread, America has an explicit problem with regard to its settlement that needs to be addressed.
However, I think a more nuanced perspective from you on European issues might be appreciated. You cannot apply the same talk of "systemic racism" to European culture - because we do not have the sediment of historical segregational policy floating around our political and cultural systems to the same extent as the US.
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racism
Sept 28, 2020 17:34:51 GMT
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Post by daveythefatboy on Sept 28, 2020 17:34:51 GMT
Again, I think we are at cross-purposes here. You are talking about an explicitly American experience, with mention of indigenous communities and those who "arrived unwillingly". There is little or none of that particular context in either the UK or Europe as a whole. I get that the issue of racism has variables in the US that aren't similar to Europe. As I've mentioned previously in this thread, America has an explicit problem with regard to its settlement that needs to be addressed. However, I think a more nuanced perspective from you on European issues might be appreciated. You cannot apply the same talk of "systemic racism" to European culture - because we do not have the sediment of historical segregational policy floating around our political and cultural systems to the same extent as the US. I don’t know if we actually are at cross purposes. I’m fully mindful of the fact that I’m talking to people in different countries. That’s why I’m reminding you that these factors can exist. They aren’t only U.S. specific. Finally - I am beyond dubious about your claim regarding systemic racism. It does not comport with the experiences of the European people of color I’ve known.
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toomanyhatz
god
I've met him/her. He/she's great!!
Posts: 3,265
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racism
Sept 28, 2020 18:08:33 GMT
Post by toomanyhatz on Sept 28, 2020 18:08:33 GMT
You are talking about an explicitly American experience, with mention of indigenous communities and those who "arrived unwillingly". There is little or none of that particular context in either the UK or Europe as a whole. I get that the issue of racism has variables in the US that aren't similar to Europe. As I've mentioned previously in this thread, America has an explicit problem with regard to its settlement that needs to be addressed. However, I think a more nuanced perspective from you on European issues might be appreciated. You cannot apply the same talk of "systemic racism" to European culture - because we do not have the sediment of historical segregational policy floating around our political and cultural systems to the same extent as the US. It's easy to oversimplify the issue, so I realize I'm doing so to a degree, but... Where do you think we learned it from? Systematic racism was built-in to US culture early - we carried it with us on the Mayflower. Maybe there are fewer people "arriving unwillingly" but the UK most certainly had a role in creating those systematic conditions.
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Deleted
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racism
Sept 28, 2020 20:17:19 GMT
Post by Deleted on Sept 28, 2020 20:17:19 GMT
The UK didn't need to set up segregational polices at home when we already owned the colonies. Or is it because the working class culture in the UK was always to leave school at 16 and get into a trade, regardless of family politics, and the expectation that a working class kid could go to further or higher education is only a very new thing?
In my lifetime, leaving age was 15, and both my parents left at 14. When I went up in 1966, it was still a big deal for someone from my class and background to get into university, rather than leaving at 16 to go to a polytechnic, secretarial college or other type of trade school
I find it crazy to think that I'm equal to only one other person as the most formally "educated" person in my family's history. I personally think the closing of the Polytechnics were a great loss to many places, but this is nothing about racism so I'm digressing.
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Deleted
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 12:11:54 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 12:11:54 GMT
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Post by Half Machine Lipschitz on Apr 12, 2021 13:19:21 GMT
Of course all the idiots they quote (PJ Watson, Andy Ngo, et al) scream bloody murder if a self-professed Marxist buys a house, but are silent when libertarians avail themselves of government services. Oh well, whatever riles up the morons makes for good headlines.
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Post by daveythefatboy on Apr 12, 2021 14:28:07 GMT
First off, $1.4M isn’t really all that crazy is Los Angeles. The median house price in the city is currently around $950k: www.noradarealestate.com/blog/los-angeles-real-estate-market/The typical price of a home in Topanga Canyon is $1.4M: www.zillow.com/topanga-ca/home-values/As a Los Angeles native, I know the area pretty well. While it IS a desirable and expensive (even relative to LA) neighborhood, it is hardly what you’d call swank. People who live in the canyon do so to live in something that feels more like nature that most of LA. But we’re not talking about opulence here. Just the luxury of a nice, somewhat secluded landscape. A lot of the area still feels like the hippy arts community it was when I was growing up. Apparently her house is 2400 square feet. Similar in size to mine. The point being: The way the right-wing media is framing this, you’d think she bought the house next to George Clooney’s. But she’s pretty much just living the way any upper-middle-class Angeleno might choose to. So the real question is: Does a successful Black woman have a right to live wherever she chooses, or do her critics insist that she live in a ‘blacker’ neighborhood?
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Sneelock
god
I write the songs that make the young girls cry
Posts: 9,010
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 16:20:45 GMT
Post by Sneelock on Apr 12, 2021 16:20:45 GMT
I'm going to say something. I'm not sure what it is yet but don't you DARE say it's racist... whatever it is.
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Deleted
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 18:00:50 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 18:00:50 GMT
So the real question is: Does a successful Black woman have a right to live wherever she chooses, or do her critics insist that she live in a ‘blacker’ neighborhood? I'd be surprised if you get an answer from Markus on that one.
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 18:16:02 GMT
Post by Reactionary Rage on Apr 12, 2021 18:16:02 GMT
Race grifting is a profitable business big lad! Even for hardcore Marxists.
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Sneelock
god
I write the songs that make the young girls cry
Posts: 9,010
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Post by Sneelock on Apr 12, 2021 18:20:11 GMT
I thought Her book "When They Call you a Terrorist" was a terrific read and profoundly moving.
that book didn't write itself. she has big media contracts now. should she drop her money from an airplane in the inner city? if she did, you can bet somebody would complain about it.
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Deleted
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 18:22:21 GMT
Post by Deleted on Apr 12, 2021 18:22:21 GMT
Race grifting is a profitable business big lad! Even for hardcore Marxists. Aye, but you hope, want and try to give most charities/organizations the benefit of the doubt. Considering the millions raised, when you read about satellite organizations that haven't received funding and lack of money drifting through to black communities it doesn't look good. I'm sure it will come to a head between all the leaders and organizations, that would be fun to be in that meeting.
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racism
Apr 12, 2021 18:58:02 GMT
via mobile
Post by daveythefatboy on Apr 12, 2021 18:58:02 GMT
Race grifting is a profitable business big lad! Even for hardcore Marxists. Aye, but you hope, want and try to give most charities/organizations the benefit of the doubt. Considering the millions raised, when you read about satellite organizations that haven't received funding and lack of money drifting through to black communities it doesn't look good. I'm sure it will come to a head between all the leaders and organizations, that would be fun to be in that meeting. So what exactly is the assumption here? That she has skirted funds from BLM? That certainly SEEMS to be what you two are insinuating. Care to provide some proof?
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toomanyhatz
god
I've met him/her. He/she's great!!
Posts: 3,265
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Post by toomanyhatz on Apr 12, 2021 18:58:05 GMT
www.forbes.com/2009/12/17/nonprofits-biggest-salaries-personal-finance-millionaires.html?sh=23438f0552a7...but by all means, let's concentrate on the one who wants to live in a slightly nicer than average home in one of the most expensive cities in the US. The noive! Reminds me of the guy that booked a semi-known Marxist singer/songwriter from the UK into one of LA's folk clubs, and complained that he wanted the standard fee for artists traveling from the UK to play in a 250-seat club. Like he was supposed to incur those expenses himself and accept less than he's worth because the proletariat or something. (Cue up that photo of Billy Bragg's house yet again...)
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