the cultural decline of the US

[Deleted]

What are we talking about here though?
If we're talking popular culture (as opposed to say high art or folk culture) then the Anglo/American cultural output has been the dominant cultural force of the post-war decades. It is changing now, witness the huge popularity of K Pop, but it's a relatively recent thing.

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Nov 22, 2020 14:19:18 GMT @madcyril1 said:

Anglo/American cultural output has been the dominant cultural force of the post-war decades. It is changing now, witness the huge popularity of K Pop, but it's a relatively recent thing.

That's what I'm saying. How do you see it playing out over the coming decades?

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It does seem when countries are involved in nationalistic urges and the respondent turmoil that they aren't really artistically productive.

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Google 'American century'...

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i remember reading articles about it being over during the early 70s (social unrest, Nam, women's lib, gangs, drugs, population boom, decline of unions/manufacturing, etc.,), every one has their limited view. The US economic engine is sound, innovation continues, etc.,

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One also has to consider a lot of creativity is routed through its format, and only stays within that format and its constraints never developing beyond cleverness or just good: tiktok, twitter, instagram, facebook, blogs, tumblr, etc., and all the formats junked and left behind.

[Reactionary Rage]

Nov 22, 2020 14:23:37 GMT ~ / % ? * said:

It does seem when countries are involved in nationalistic urges and the respondent turmoil that they aren't really artistically productive.

If you look at  the 19th century in Europe and the political and social turmoil there and then classical and opera I think you could make the opposite case.

Look at Wagner.  Look at the Ring Cycle.  He was trying to create nationalist art for a new nation.  

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Nov 22, 2020 14:39:21 GMT Reactionary Rage said:

Nov 22, 2020 14:23:37 GMT ~ / % ? * said:

It does seem when countries are involved in nationalistic urges and the respondent turmoil that they aren't really artistically productive.

If you look at  the 19th century in Europe and the political and social turmoil there and then classical and opera I think you could make the opposite case.

Look at Wagner.  Look at the Ring Cycle.  He was trying to create nationalist art for a new nation.  

maybe, they were more concerned with formation of a nation state not nativist whitewashing nationalistic movements of existing nation states

[Reactionary Rage]

I'm not sure why you are using "nationalistic" here though? In the sense that in an age of Trump and Brexit etc you believe we will not be as artistically productive because of this somehow?

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In the US, any artistic response to Trump/MAGA is of the moment, fleeting and not really nuanced or ruminative, which will come later, and responding to Trump, etc., may be distracting creativity from more worthwhile projects


If anything Covid has forced focus and isolation on artists, possibly generating greater craft and results, we'll see...

[Reactionary Rage]

I don't think politics and music mix really. Maybe it might create a greater emphasis on escapism, perhaps, or just meaningless waffle through repetitive pop music (EDM as the yanks now say) as the kids retreat into hedonism. I dunno. It's hard to be positive and think that there may be some resurgence or "golden age" coming from somewhere else. That's not gonna happen.

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In the US it has already been happening the roots music scene is quietly massive, and very welcoming, regardless of proficiency, gender, race, etc., so there is all kinds of frisson and fusion going on, its not been subsumed by facebook, tiktok, instagram yet
and this has been the year of largest sales of guitars in NAMMs 119 year history.

[Reactionary Rage]

You're not really selling it to me Gav.

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That's fine, I really wasn't looking to this to turn into a music bashing thread.

[Deleted]

Nov 22, 2020 15:22:27 GMT ~ / % ? * said:

and this has been the year of largest sales of guitars in NAMMs 119 year history.

Perhaps they had a 'buy one, get one FREE' offer.